Do you question the existence of God?

Khaya · Post by **Khaya** » 24 Jun 2017, 20:46

There's no need to apologize. Tossing opinions and ideas back and forth is how you make them stronger. I think you can make yours stronger if you were to say that God helps you understand the logic of things better, not God is needed for us to see the logic in things.

Interestingly, I just started reading the Philosopher Charles Peirce's "The Fixation of Belief" today, and I was amazed at how relevant it is to this discussion. It's about the four different mental processes people use to determine why and how they form their beliefs. One is the method of authority. I recommend you read it. Peirce points out that "doubt is an uneasy and dissatisfied state from which we struggle to free ourselves and pass into a state of belief; while belief is a calm and satisfactory state which we do not wish to avoid, or to change to a belief in anything else." Here is an article about the method of tenacity, which I think is the most insightful. Note that the term "inquiry" in the reading means the struggling and figuring out of what to believe.

jimthorne2 · Post by **jimthorne2** » 25 Jun 2017, 16:02

I don't have a problem with authority. I accept authority. This acceptance is the basis of my belief.

Khaya · Post by **Khaya** » 25 Jun 2017, 17:46

Exactly? I never said you have a problem with authority? That was my point, that your method of forming belief is the method of authority. And perhaps tenacity.

Oh, I didn't realize we weren't able to send external links, I thought we just couldn't do self promotion. Well, it's (removed by mod). I hope I'm allowed to say that much.

jimthorne2 · Post by **jimthorne2** » 25 Jun 2017, 18:36

Do you have a problem with authority or should I ask?

Khaya · Post by **Khaya** » 25 Jun 2017, 21:34

I'm not exactly sure what you mean by that. Do you mean if I have a problem with authority figures in general? No, I'm respectful to teachers, police officers, bosses, pastors, etc. Do you mean if I have a problem with blindly accepting the opinions of an authority just because they are an authority? Yes, I can see a problem in that.

Do you mean if I have a problem with His authority? God's? He is the greatest authority and knows everything, so you should do and believe what he says. Well... if that's what you mean, I don't understand why I'd be asked that. Because as I said before, I'm not confident that there's a god in the first place, let alone the God described in the Bible.

Or, do you mean if I have a problem with the method of authority when deciding what beliefs to take on? Yes, I believe that's an out-dated way of thinking of things. Here's a quote from an ethics history book. 'John Milton and later enlightenment scholars challenged the medieval view that truth existed out there and is revealed by God or other authority figures. Rather, enlightenment scholars advocated using intellect, judgment, and basic senses to discover what is true and what isn't. They gave birth to ideas of democracy and rational government, and to the scientific method-- truths are perceived by senses and intellect. They are discovered, rational, verifiable, recorded, and replicatable."

Harmony Hills · Post by **Harmony Hills** » 26 Jun 2017, 03:23

No. Because if i question His existence, then there is no reason for me to keep on living and then i'll keep questioning what the hell is the reason of waking up and facing the day of hardships. So no. My father died when i was 11 and i am suffering an illness right now and the only reason i keep on living this wretched life is because God has His plans for me.

bwarthur · Post by **bwarthur** » 26 Jun 2017, 03:35

no. because if there were a God, he would make himself by now. considering his obsession of wanting to be worshipped and be given sacrifices. medieval gods are medieval gods even God who is from the medieval times.

jimthorne2 · Post by **jimthorne2** » 26 Jun 2017, 09:29

Well, I have accepted God as my authority. His method is to speak. My response is to listen.

Marylynn · Post by **Marylynn** » 26 Jun 2017, 10:35

No, else how did the first man and woman come into existence?

Ayosinmi · Post by **Ayosinmi** » 26 Jun 2017, 11:50

I have never questioned His existence.
I see the hills and mountains, I watch the clouds and the elements.
I see animals in different forms and shapes.
I see humans in their entirety.
Unless someone can point out to me that he made all these things, if not, I know of a fact that God is God. Nothing to question.

Khaya · Post by **Khaya** » 26 Jun 2017, 15:54

That's fine. I might not agree with it and see problems in it, but I respect people's choice to believe what they want to believe. It's amazing how practically every person on Earth believes something different, even if it's different because of the slightest variation. Like one Christian isn't going to believe exactly the same thing as another Christian.

I'm sorry if I stirred you up a little with my constant disagreement. I haven't been fully sure, but I've been getting hints of... prickliness? from you. It's just that I believe opinions should go through the falsification process, because we can't know for sure what is true, but we can know what's false. However, practically everyone has some degree of ego and pride in what they say, so constant disagreement and flaw finding can make them upset. I think from now on, I should practice having a certain amount of times I can point out the flaw in an opinion, like three, and if it becomes more that that I should retreat from the conversation.

And again I could be wrong, but being in this discussion for a while now, I've gotten the impression that you feel contempt for people that have different beliefs and a different way of thinking than your own. I'm not trying to insult you. This impression started to form because sometimes in this topic, when someone said they're not sure if God exists, or don't believe God exists, you replied negatively. Not in a sense of disagreeing with them and showing them why you think they're wrong and you're right, but just demeaning them and disagreeing to disagree. For example, in response to someone who explained why they're an agnostic, your response was "There is no way to know anything. This is beyond skepticism. It is agnosticism. Better understand as I refuse to know anything." What if someone said, Christians who don't believe in scientific theories "That is beyond skepticism. It is Christianity. Better understand as I refuse to know anything." Again, I'm not trying to insult you, I'm just hoping by bring this to your attention, you'll tweak this behavior. Another example is when I mentioned Buddhists have spirituality but don't believe in a God, you were quick to dismiss the beliefs of the religion without knowing more about it, saying Buddhist worship their spiritual selves.

Should we quickly dismiss a different belief with scrutiny without knowing their side? I was a Christian for about 15 years, went to church practically every Sunday, and went to a Catholic high school. I've studied the Bible, and though many modern day Christians believe in practicing tolerance because they see the morality of it, I've only really seen passages in the bible that call for intolerance and religious exclusivity. This is one of the reasons I changed my belief. If someone believes something different or has a different way of thinking, and it's not bringing harm to anyone, why show contempt? Because it's not your way of thinking? Can't we be compassionate and tolerant? We're all people figuring out life.

jimthorne2 · Post by **jimthorne2** » 26 Jun 2017, 16:55

You seem very opinionate. You seem to think that you know more than me. That doesn't surprise me. Most people know more than I know. I'm not sure that knowledge is the key to life.

Khaya · Post by **Khaya** » 26 Jun 2017, 17:20

But, then... don't you think you know the key to life and I don't, so knowing more than me? Isn't everybody trapped in their own heads and think they're likely right until shown otherwise? If something is wrong in what I'm saying, I'd want someone to point it out despite my pride. And you were responding to everyone's post, isn't that being opinionated and thinking you're right?

I think this is when I should cut the discussion and respectfully retreat. I'm sorry for my excessive explaining and fault finding, and thinking I'm in the right when perhaps I'm wrong.

Thomas Zman · Post by **Thomas Zman** » 26 Jun 2017, 17:28

I do not question His existence. Though I do try to guess His reasoning. For the atheists out there, how can miracles and after-life experiences be explained? I know that I have had a lot of guidance in my life from my Guardian Angel.