MILF fantasies and mental health

Howlan · Post by **Howlan** » 05 Feb 2020, 06:36

LyorBoone wrote: ↑04 Feb 2020, 13:36
Misael wrote: ↑02 Feb 2020, 08:26 Though the this MILG issue is controversial and sensitive at the same time, it is also very intriguing and unusual to be tackled in a novel. I would like to read this book and probably do my research also regarding this issue on mental health.
I would add that it is extra odd to be tackled in a fantasy tale. It's a unique story point for sure, but in a world of fantasy one generally expects an escape from the strangeness in our world in favor of finding a fantastical world to explore. A pilgrim effect. Some may argue this inclusion makes the story more gritty, but I'm one that finds it an odd subplot for the genre. I think it works better in a story like the Bate's Motel series' exploration of Psycho where the audience seeks to understand a creepy character created by the strangeness of the world we live in.

Yes but the way the author ties some of the loose ends by addressing Adam's aversion to Vikky and Adam's attraction to JoAnn feels really satisfactory.

Howlan · Post by **Howlan** » 05 Feb 2020, 06:39

Misael wrote: ↑04 Feb 2020, 18:02
LyorBoone wrote: ↑04 Feb 2020, 13:36
Misael wrote: ↑02 Feb 2020, 08:26 Though the this MILG issue is controversial and sensitive at the same time, it is also very intriguing and unusual to be tackled in a novel. I would like to read this book and probably do my research also regarding this issue on mental health.

I would add that it is extra odd to be tackled in a fantasy tale. It's a unique story point for sure, but in a world of fantasy one generally expects an escape from the strangeness in our world in favor of finding a fantastical world to explore. A pilgrim effect. Some may argue this inclusion makes the story more gritty, but I'm one that finds it an odd subplot for the genre. I think it works better in a story like the Bate's Motel series' exploration of Psycho where the audience seeks to understand a creepy character created by the strangeness of the world we live in.

I agree with you. I also think, this issue could be a start of this plot being explored and create a surge of stories anchored on it. Very odd and gritty, though not impossible, but creative nonetheless. Creative mind at its best!

Yes, kudos to the author for this. It felt very natural at the end when Adam's feeling of attraction to JoAnn made her not blood-related and aversion to Vikky blood-related.

missrlynnf · Post by **missrlynnf** » 05 Feb 2020, 06:48

I agree with Laura Lee; I found Adam's sexual arousal by his mother incredibly off-putting. So much so, that I stopped reading after the first instance of it.
I also felt the author was very heavy handed with the suicidal/mental illness approach right from the start. It seems to be the central point of the story, which makes me feel that it should not be in a YA genre (a genre geared toward 12-18 years olds). Just in those first few pages, the whole story felt more adult than YA.
I wish there had been some sort of disclaimer or warning of what this book actually addressed within the summary. The summary makes it seem like a great, dystopian type story that you could really get into and doesn't hint at all at the heavy mental illness struggles.

Julianna · Post by **Julianna** » 05 Feb 2020, 09:02

I think the book could have done without it. It’s one of those things that either creep you out or you can sympathize with. I am on the creep out side. But then again I am a female, so I have a hard time relating to mommy issues

Sophy Chunge · Post by **Sophy Chunge** » 05 Feb 2020, 10:24

Seems like an allusion of Sigmund Freud's theory of human development and the Oedipus complex where son's become attracted to mother's. Now has this character become fixated on that stage? It's shocking but it's nothing new.

Tchrjokes456 · Post by **Tchrjokes456** » 05 Feb 2020, 11:11

The initial presentation of the Oedipus complex in this novel was very off-putting, but I found it to be necessary later on. Adam needed that pivotal moment to realize that he "wasn't a monster" to facilitate making the decision to stay with Carly when he otherwise might have chosen power. Had he thought of himself as other than one of the good guys, he might have joined the other side of the battle.

Twylla · Post by **Twylla** » 05 Feb 2020, 17:05

His fantasies of his mother were definitely part of his hidden identity. Once he realized that he was a Descendant he understood his impure thoughts for his mother. He was clearly a troubled young man, but one of the beautiful things about this story was that as he understood they WHY behind his actions and feelings, he was able to mature. This gives hope for other teens going through troubled times.

Laura Lee · Post by **Laura Lee** » 05 Feb 2020, 17:09

missrlynnf wrote: ↑05 Feb 2020, 06:48 I agree with Laura Lee; I found Adam's sexual arousal by his mother incredibly off-putting. So much so, that I stopped reading after the first instance of it.
I also felt the author was very heavy handed with the suicidal/mental illness approach right from the start. It seems to be the central point of the story, which makes me feel that it should not be in a YA genre (a genre geared toward 12-18 years olds). Just in those first few pages, the whole story felt more adult than YA.
I wish there had been some sort of disclaimer or warning of what this book actually addressed within the summary. The summary makes it seem like a great, dystopian type story that you could really get into and doesn't hint at all at the heavy mental illness struggles.

Exactly. This just did not seem appropriate in a novel ostensibly for teen readers. It's described as a teen superhero-type book, but I did not get that from it at all. It seemed very unnecessary to have as a plot point. Thanks for your response!

shannonkate8 · Post by **shannonkate8** » 06 Feb 2020, 13:52

mariana90 wrote: ↑04 Feb 2020, 18:52 LOL, I was just joking.

I'm currently reading The Stages of Life (2017) by Hugh Crago and he talks about both complexes as being very common. He doesn't explicitly say that one is more predominant than the other, but from his words I infer that there isn't a marked difference in their frequency either way.

In regards as to the author knowing about the Oedipus Complex, being as well-read as she seems to be (I checked her profile online), I'm guessing she is very much aware of it.

That seems like such an interesting read! I'll definitely have to check it out. For many psychologists completely ignoring Freud, it would be interesting to read something that may back up his wacky ideas. And end up helping other books!

Nym182 · Post by **Nym182** » 06 Feb 2020, 13:58

That's an interesting thought... I think it was both. I am sure that the author could have come up with a different method of illustrating Adam's connection with Jo. For example, he could just be really tuned in to her, or have a psychic connection with her (such as being able to predict what she is going to say, or know she's feeling sad about something) rather than having a physical attraction/obsession with her.

djr6090 · Post by **djr6090** » 06 Feb 2020, 14:35

Laura Lee wrote: ↑01 Feb 2020, 11:14 What are your thoughts on Adam's fantasies of his mother and jealousy of his father? Based on the various elements of the book (such as how his repulsion of Vikki was explained as being genetic), would you consider this integral to the plot? Or did you get the feeling this was added for just shock value and not essential for the overall development of the story?

I must be an idiot. What is an MILF issue?

Laura Lee · Post by **Laura Lee** » 06 Feb 2020, 15:47

djr6090 wrote: ↑06 Feb 2020, 14:35 I must be an idiot. What is an MILF issue?

You're not an idiot. If you haven't heard it before, how would you know? It's a rather crude expression that stands for "Mother I'd like to F%#@."

Nym182 · Post by **Nym182** » 06 Feb 2020, 16:02

missrlynnf wrote: ↑05 Feb 2020, 06:48 I agree with Laura Lee; I found Adam's sexual arousal by his mother incredibly off-putting. So much so, that I stopped reading after the first instance of it.
I also felt the author was very heavy handed with the suicidal/mental illness approach right from the start. It seems to be the central point of the story, which makes me feel that it should not be in a YA genre (a genre geared toward 12-18 years olds). Just in those first few pages, the whole story felt more adult than YA.
I wish there had been some sort of disclaimer or warning of what this book actually addressed within the summary. The summary makes it seem like a great, dystopian type story that you could really get into and doesn't hint at all at the heavy mental illness struggles.

I agree with you... As a veteran of some really dark books, I was deeply unsettled by some of the things tackled in this book. I think it would have made a much better adult book!

steffielara95 · Post by **steffielara95** » 06 Feb 2020, 17:04

I thought without this element, the first few pages introduced enough tension and suspense anyway and would have drawn the reader in. As others have said, the desire for his mother is a step too far in terms of risking alienating the reader.

gilliansisley · Post by **gilliansisley** » 06 Feb 2020, 20:40

I was only a few pages into the book and almost put the thing down for good.

The sexual lust, and obsessive romantic feelings for his mom truly creeped me the hell out. I was really having trouble imagining in what world such descriptive lusting for one's mother is appropriate in a YA book?

And then almost directly after she drives off and I breathe a sigh of relief, Adam recalls how he chloroformed, kidnapped, almost raped and facilitated the death of an innocent young girl and I sat there thinking to myself, "What the f*ck am I reading!?"

I was deeply disturbed. I continued reading the rest of the book with a cringe-type look on my face because I just couldn't get passed how this whole novel started.