Is VR a deviation from the book

Use this forum to discuss the August 2020 Book of the month, " Natural Relief for Anxiety and Stress: A Practical Guide" by Gustavo Kinrys, MD.
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Joseph_ngaruiya
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Re: Is VR a deviation from the book

Post by Joseph_ngaruiya »

RomeoMontague98 wrote: 21 Aug 2020, 05:00 Well the book is about natural healing methods. Is VR natural? No, I don't think so. Virtual reality is, first and foremost, brought about through the use of cutting-edge technologies.
I do not think technology is "natural" in the sense that other therapies outlined in the book are.
True, VR is not natural because it's a technological product. But as highlighted in this book, if it involves no medication, then it can be categorized as a "natural remedy." It's the same as listening to music.
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Post by Joseph_ngaruiya »

mariana90 wrote: 21 Aug 2020, 18:36
Joseph_ngaruiya wrote: 20 Aug 2020, 14:52
Miraphery wrote: 18 Aug 2020, 15:56 I see your point but I think that what the author means by "naturall" is anything that excludes medication.
If I may disagree, I think there are also natural medicinations like herbs. Does it mean we can’t categorize them as a natural remedy because they’re a kind of medication?
I think Miraphery is talking about lab-synthesized medication. Herbs are a natural occurrence, they exist in Nature without any human interference, so they are not being excluded.
Lab-synthesis is a way of making the medication more effective by producing it in a manner that the body responds to quickly. I believe if the ingredients used are natural, it can be a natural source too.
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Post by xsquare »

I think it really depends on the working definition of 'natural' here. If we are referring to natural as in 'naturally occurring', then no, VR is considered a deviation because it's a man-made product. On the other hand, if you are referring to 'natural' as in without the introduction of any foreign chemical substances like medication, then I think it's perfectly fine to include it in the book.

Personally I'm tending towards the second definition.
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Post by Howlan »

Joseph_ngaruiya wrote: 20 Aug 2020, 14:31
jaimemiller wrote: 17 Aug 2020, 03:16 I don't think the use of virtual reality is "contradictory" at all. As long as the remedy does not require ingesting pharmaceutical drugs, you can call a substance a natural remedy.
Contradiction would only occur if VR included medication. How about using a gadget is used to burn incense sticks that are medicted, is it in the natural remedy category?
VR is not a deviation from the book at all. It is difficult to categorize it in natural remedy so the author includes it in technological remedy. It should not be used with prior experience and can be harmful if used regularly.
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Post by Howlan »

Joseph_ngaruiya wrote: 20 Aug 2020, 14:33
Miraphery wrote: 18 Aug 2020, 15:56 I see your point but I think that what the author means by "naturall" is anything that excludes medication.
VR has been found to be effective and with fewer side effects. That’s why it has gained popularity.
Yes, and also the fact that it is able to provide you with the virtual simulation of any environment that you can relax in based on your preferences. It is getting better and better and has been a great help in treating stress and anxiety.
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Post by Howlan »

Joseph_ngaruiya wrote: 20 Aug 2020, 14:52
Miraphery wrote: 18 Aug 2020, 15:56 I see your point but I think that what the author means by "naturall" is anything that excludes medication.
If I may disagree, I think there are also natural medicinations like herbs. Does it mean we can’t categorize them as a natural remedy because they’re a kind of medication?
In the case of herbs, I think they can be difficult to use if you do not have proper experience regarding herbs so I think it is classified as natural remedy is something with anyone can practice without any significant side-effects.
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Post by Howlan »

Joseph_ngaruiya wrote: 22 Aug 2020, 02:24
jaimemiller wrote: 17 Aug 2020, 03:16 I don't think the use of virtual reality is "contradictory" at all. As long as the remedy does not require ingesting pharmaceutical drugs, you can call a substance a natural remedy.
VR can be used in many other forms, like in architecture, where it can be used to come up with buildings and an environment that fits the needs of patients suffering from stress and anxiety. Some of the natural remedies mentioned by Gustavo can be created by using VR.
Yes, natural remedies like experiencing nature, like spending time in forest or in the sea can be easily created with virtual reality. It really is a great use that can help relieve stress. Another thing VR is useful recreating your phobias so that the patients can get exposure to their fear regulated by an expert.
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Post by Howlan »

Joseph_ngaruiya wrote: 22 Aug 2020, 02:25
EvaDar wrote: 17 Aug 2020, 11:58 I do think VR therapy is considered a natural intervention. Anything that is not a medication or other therapy promoted by Western medicine can be considered natural. I also agree with other posters that VR therapy can cause other problems. I think it would be most effective used with the knowledge and supervision of a mental health practitioner. I think the book recommends that.

I do see how it can work to allow a person to "practice" things that carry anxiety in an artificial reality as a way of titrating the intensity of the anxiety prior to trying the behavior in a real situation. Apparently VR therapy is being used quite a bit now. Great discussion.
Recently, VR has become too real. It's now possible to simulate an environment before a patient experiences the real one. That way, therapists can figure out if the environment would work or not.
Yes, VR has been a great improvements in releasing stress. Recreating a environment in which the user is comfortable in helps a lot in relieving stress. Stimulating working environments and also using exposure therapy has been one of the big highlights of VR. Also exposure can be limited according the user's comfort which helps people to get a hold of their conditions.
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Post by Howlan »

Joseph_ngaruiya wrote: 22 Aug 2020, 02:26
Miraphery wrote: 18 Aug 2020, 15:56 I see your point but I think that what the author means by "naturall" is anything that excludes medication.
VR is part of the natural ways of combating stress and anxiety. Yes, it's man-made, but that doesn't make it an exclusion to the natural remedies mentioned by Kinrys.
I think the author correctly included VR in the technological section rather than in the natural one. One, VR can be used without prior experience in the absence of a professional. Also, it has side-effects if used frequently, which is a strain on the sensory organs.
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Post by Howlan »

Joseph_ngaruiya wrote: 22 Aug 2020, 02:28
JGretz-7 wrote: 20 Aug 2020, 18:47 I don't believe that virtual reality is a deviation at all. The authors discuss how it can be used as a method of treatment with professional guidance to assist people in facing their fears. The fact that is uses technology to do so is really no different than using white noise or soothing music to alter moods.

Could this mean that all VR methods used must require a professional guide?
Yes, I think using VR without any prior experience or professional guide can be less effective. VR can have side-effects if used frequently for a long time like strain in your eyes and ears. Also, exposure therapy in the absence of a professional can be less useful.
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Post by Howlan »

Joseph_ngaruiya wrote: 22 Aug 2020, 02:32
RomeoMontague98 wrote: 21 Aug 2020, 05:00 Well the book is about natural healing methods. Is VR natural? No, I don't think so. Virtual reality is, first and foremost, brought about through the use of cutting-edge technologies.
I do not think technology is "natural" in the sense that other therapies outlined in the book are.
True, VR is not natural because it's a technological product. But as highlighted in this book, if it involves no medication, then it can be categorized as a "natural remedy." It's the same as listening to music.
Listening to music is not essentially involves putting your headphones on. It can also be listening to live music. Even simpler, it can be listening to a bird sing. That being said VR is controversial to be classified as a natural remedy.
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Post by Howlan »

Joseph_ngaruiya wrote: 22 Aug 2020, 02:36
mariana90 wrote: 21 Aug 2020, 18:36
Joseph_ngaruiya wrote: 20 Aug 2020, 14:52

If I may disagree, I think there are also natural medicinations like herbs. Does it mean we can’t categorize them as a natural remedy because they’re a kind of medication?
I think Miraphery is talking about lab-synthesized medication. Herbs are a natural occurrence, they exist in Nature without any human interference, so they are not being excluded.
Lab-synthesis is a way of making the medication more effective by producing it in a manner that the body responds to quickly. I believe if the ingredients used are natural, it can be a natural source too.
Not really. If you see it that way then many medications can be classified as natural. But still, the problem with these is that they need to be prescribed and not something you can take as you wish, as it has an effect on the hormonal balance of the body.
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Post by Joseph_ngaruiya »

xsquare wrote: 22 Aug 2020, 03:52 I think it really depends on the working definition of 'natural' here. If we are referring to natural as in 'naturally occurring', then no, VR is considered a deviation because it's a man-made product. On the other hand, if you are referring to 'natural' as in without the introduction of any foreign chemical substances like medication, then I think it's perfectly fine to include it in the book.

Personally I'm tending towards the second definition.
That's very correct, the fact that VR is man-made means it can be categorised
as unnatural. But since it doesn't include using medication it can also be termed natural.
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Post by Howlan »

Joseph_ngaruiya wrote: 23 Aug 2020, 20:44
xsquare wrote: 22 Aug 2020, 03:52 I think it really depends on the working definition of 'natural' here. If we are referring to natural as in 'naturally occurring', then no, VR is considered a deviation because it's a man-made product. On the other hand, if you are referring to 'natural' as in without the introduction of any foreign chemical substances like medication, then I think it's perfectly fine to include it in the book.

Personally I'm tending towards the second definition.
That's very correct, the fact that VR is man-made means it can be categorised
as unnatural. But since it doesn't include using medication it can also be termed natural.
In a way that can be true as the author thought it fit the bill as alternative to medication. Though personally I would not categorize VR as a natural, I agree with the author's decision to list it as a technologically based remedy and I do not think it is a deviation from the book.
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Post by mariana90 »

Joseph_ngaruiya wrote: 22 Aug 2020, 02:36
mariana90 wrote: 21 Aug 2020, 18:36
Joseph_ngaruiya wrote: 20 Aug 2020, 14:52

If I may disagree, I think there are also natural medicinations like herbs. Does it mean we can’t categorize them as a natural remedy because they’re a kind of medication?
I think Miraphery is talking about lab-synthesized medication. Herbs are a natural occurrence, they exist in Nature without any human interference, so they are not being excluded.
Lab-synthesis is a way of making the medication more effective by producing it in a manner that the body responds to quickly. I believe if the ingredients used are natural, it can be a natural source too.
I'm talking about paracetamol, ibuprofen, etc. Medications synthesized in a lab that do not exist in Nature, created by scientists.
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