Free Will

Use this forum to discuss the March 2021 Book of the month, "The Biblical Clock: The Untold Secrets Linking the Universe and Humanity with God’s Plan" by Daniel Friedmann, Dania Sheldon
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Re: Free Will

Post by cd20 »

KanaSmriti wrote: 17 Apr 2021, 08:03 If God comes to me and says that its been only 2 years that everything has been created, I must have been in a shock. And its quite agreeable that there wouldn't be any free will.
I am not sure I understand your response. Do you think we have free will? Or that we do not have free will? I do not believe that God is going to come to any of us and tell us that it has only been two years since creation. Obviously, it has been much longer than that.
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Post by Prabhat Sunil Mathur »

Honestly, I am very influenced by the idea of free will and the reality of spirituality. I read about this idea previously also, I say, It is very much mind capturing and a beautiful theory.
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Post by cd20 »

Prabhat7263 wrote: 22 Apr 2021, 01:35 Honestly, I am very influenced by the idea of free will and the reality of spirituality. I read about this idea previously also, I say, It is very much mind capturing and a beautiful theory.
Yes, I have heard of free will most of my life. I had not heard of it in relation to creation, so that is a new thought. Thank you for sharing your perspective on this.
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Post by fiocha1996_25 »

I believe the reason God doesn't reveal himself is because of free will. I think God reveals himself in different ways but, like the creation of the earth, it's not obvious. The fact that we can choose what to believe or not means God is not trying to force us into anything, I liked all the perspectives, help me see things from a different perspective!
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Post by cd20 »

fiocha1996_25 wrote: 22 Apr 2021, 13:08 I believe the reason God doesn't reveal himself is because of free will. I think God reveals himself in different ways but, like the creation of the earth, it's not obvious. The fact that we can choose what to believe or not means God is not trying to force us into anything, I liked all the perspectives, help me see things from a different perspective!
Thanks for sharing your thoughts. I agree with you, that God reveals himself in many different ways, but it's not obvious. I love that we do have free will and God is not trying to force us into anything. I have enjoyed reading and learning from the other posts as well, it does help us to see things from a different perspective. I love hearing what other people think.
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Post by Eddy E »

i never really saw it like that but there is truth in the statement. God has given us free will, to presuppose that he hides himself so that we can function in our free will put its succinctly. i think the absence of free will defeats the purpose of relationship it will only look like a system of slave master relationship.
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Post by cd20 »

Eddy E wrote: 22 Apr 2021, 15:04 i never really saw it like that but there is truth in the statement. God has given us free will, to presuppose that he hides himself so that we can function in our free will put its succinctly. i think the absence of free will defeats the purpose of relationship it will only look like a system of slave master relationship.
it is good to learn from other people's perspectives, it broadens our horizons. I am not sure that I completely agree with the author's statement, I think the two are not necessarily related. But, I believe it could be a reason that God is not physically present with us today. I agree that the absence of free will would be like a slave/master relationship. I am thankful that God gave us the gift of free will. Thank you for sharing your thoughts!!
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Post by gina_rae73 »

The take on Adam and Eve in the garden expressed free will in a sense that Eve did have a choice influenced by the serpent. Free will can be influenced by our surroundings and the sin stemmed from Adams consummation his relations to quickly which is a human instinct. His carnal desires influenced his decision or his free will. Their acts of free will led to the sin.
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Post by cd20 »

gina_rae73 wrote: 23 Apr 2021, 09:46 The take on Adam and Eve in the garden expressed free will in a sense that Eve did have a choice influenced by the serpent. Free will can be influenced by our surroundings and the sin stemmed from Adams consummation his relations to quickly which is a human instinct. His carnal desires influenced his decision or his free will. Their acts of free will led to the sin.
That's true, I had not thought about it in that way. But, even though Adam and Eve could see and interact with God, they already had free will. Otherwise, Eve would not have been able to take from the tree of good and evil. Their acts of free will did lead to sin. Interesting point. Thanks for sharing your perspective.
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Post by Anusha Thatavarthi »

If you do believe in God, that is good logic. Faith, by definition, is believing in something we couldn't know for sure exists. And according to the scriptures, God solely acts based on faith. So, if he presents human beings with stone-clad truth, there will be no question of faith and no free will. And I don't believe in the six days creation.
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Post by cd20 »

anua24060 wrote: 24 Apr 2021, 01:17 If you do believe in God, that is good logic. Faith, by definition, is believing in something we couldn't know for sure exists. And according to the scriptures, God solely acts based on faith. So, if he presents human beings with stone-clad truth, there will be no question of faith and no free will. And I don't believe in the six days creation.
I do not believe that the six days of creation and free will are related. I believe the author lumped these two things together, but should not have, although it has made for interesting discussion and really makes us think about why and how we have free will. So, do you believe we have free will or not? Thank you for sharing your perspective on this.
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I don't agree with this that God is hidden because he want us to function fully as human being or because we should exercise our free will. No. My believe is that, why God is hidden has a different reason, and why most thing (not everything) happens naturally has another reason. According to the bible, God is hidden because of the first fall of man in the garden of Eden, and man deadness to God, since then, has continues to become deeper. And most thing happens naturally because nature is the original medium through which God controls man, and deal with him daily. E.g., law of karma, law of sowing and reaping, law of gravity. etc.
However, these natural laws can be transcend through prayer and intimate fellowship with God. For instance, Jesus walk on water without sinking—transcending law of gravity. An apostle in Nigeria was seen been lifted up to an height of about 1.5 feet or more while preaching.
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Post by cd20 »

GideonWrites Review wrote: 27 Apr 2021, 08:28 I don't agree with this that God is hidden because he want us to function fully as human being or because we should exercise our free will. No. My believe is that, why God is hidden has a different reason, and why most thing (not everything) happens naturally has another reason. According to the bible, God is hidden because of the first fall of man in the garden of Eden, and man deadness to God, since then, has continues to become deeper. And most thing happens naturally because nature is the original medium through which God controls man, and deal with him daily. E.g., law of karma, law of sowing and reaping, law of gravity. etc.
However, these natural laws can be transcend through prayer and intimate fellowship with God. For instance, Jesus walk on water without sinking—transcending law of gravity. An apostle in Nigeria was seen been lifted up to an height of about 1.5 feet or more while preaching.
Thank you so much for stopping by and sharing your perspective!!! I agree that God is not hidden because of creation, and you explained very well why He is hidden. I also agree that He is hidden because of the fall in the garden of Eden. You have explained your thoughts very well, again, thanks for sharing!
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GideonWrites Review wrote: 27 Apr 2021, 08:28 I don't agree with this that God is hidden because he want us to function fully as human being or because we should exercise our free will. No. My believe is that, why God is hidden has a different reason, and why most thing (not everything) happens naturally has another reason. According to the bible, God is hidden because of the first fall of man in the garden of Eden, and man deadness to God, since then, has continues to become deeper. And most thing happens naturally because nature is the original medium through which God controls man, and deal with him daily. E.g., law of karma, law of sowing and reaping, law of gravity. etc.
However, these natural laws can be transcend through prayer and intimate fellowship with God. For instance, Jesus walk on water without sinking—transcending law of gravity. An apostle in Nigeria was seen been lifted up to an height of about 1.5 feet or more while preaching.
I truly agree with you on your points about why God is hidden from man, and agree with you point of view over the author's.
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Post by WADonnelly »

I think that the author seems to believe that God purposefully deceives us to enable free will. I believe it is a mistake to take some of the bible so literally. For example, the creation of the universe in six days does not necessarily mean six days as we measure time. God is after all outside of time. The idea that God deceives to enable free will does not make much sense when you consider why certain things in the bible would be backed by science and others not.
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