"They" as a generic singular pronoun. For? Against?

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Amphigory
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"They" as a generic singular pronoun. For? Against?

Post by Amphigory »

WARNING: here be controversial grammar!

Just wondering what you all reckon of using "they" and "them" as singular sexless pronouns (as in, "if anyone knows who the recent spinach-puff thief was, could you please throttle them for me? They are a terror to our puff pastry parlor!"). Perhaps it's just because I'm younger (though I know they've been in use that way for a long time, at least since Austen), but "them" and "they" as singular sounds perfectly natural to my ear — certainly moreso than "he or she" or, even worse, "s/he". To be honest, I don't understand why it's still so debated! But then, I'm very nearly the total opposite of a grammar nazi, so that's the way I think about a lot of these kinds of issues (though misplaced apostrophes do jar my inner reading-voice).

So, thoughts? How do you get around the issue? Do you use "they", "he or she", or even one of those newfangled doohickeys like "thon" or "zee" or what-have-you?
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Maud Fitch
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Post by Maud Fitch »

There’s always been collective nouns and personal pronouns in the English language which cause debate. Do you want to treat “them” and “they” as a single person or a group of individuals? I prefer to think of “them” as plural. I would have been taught to keep everything singular when it was singular and everything plural when it was plural. For me, it makes things easier to read.

As far as I know, the rules are relaxed, for better or worse, and it’s pretty much a mix and match affair now with “them” or “they” interchangeable. Sometimes it can depend on the country in which you live, e.g. Australia grew up on the British system but I’ve been told the US approach is different.

I don’t think gender is an issue, so I have re-written your sentence as follows:

"If anyone knows who the recent spinach-puff thief was, could you please throttle the offender for me? This person is a terror to our puff pastry parlour!". Just as sexless.
"Every story has three sides to it - yours, mine and the facts" Foster Meharny Russell
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Post by Amphigory »

Definitely, there are often cases where the sentence can be rewritten to avoid the issue entirely. However, there are times when this may not be possible, or even desirable.

It's interesting that you mention readability. I have no issue reading "them" and "they" as singular pronouns, because of the context of that which comes before it. "Any person with their hair in a ponytail please report to me" vs "all the people with their hair tied in ponytails please report to me", for instance. I don't have to think any more about it than if it had been rewritten some other way.
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Post by Scott »

I think it can always be avoided by using phrases such 'he or her' or 'himself or herself.' Such as in the following sentences:
  • Please find out who was driving the car and give him or her a ticket.

    Whenever you borrow someone's car, fill his or her gas tank when I am done.
Of course, this can be overly verbose with an overly formal, exact tone. In that way it is not unlike other grammar rules or informal writing techniques in that it may be better to use in everyday speech (including character dialogue in fiction) as well as informal writing or any writing where fluency may be preferred over formality. Other examples include ending a sentence with a preposition, using contractions and using the passive tense.
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Post by Maud Fitch »

If it’s character dialogue, I don’t care if ‘they’ and ‘them’ are used or formal and informal rules are broken because that’s the personality of the character.

If the author’s grammar knowledge and proficiency are questionable, it can change the tone of the book for me.
In some cases, the singular pronoun is not needed, e.g. "Any person with hair in a ponytail please report to me".
Or “Whenever you borrow someone's car, fill the gas tank when I am (you’re) done”.
"Every story has three sides to it - yours, mine and the facts" Foster Meharny Russell
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