Sometimes you just feel like you nailed it

[iloveskiinglots]

You painted a clear picture with your words! Just enough detail.

[Carla Hurst-Chandler]

OMG....today!

Working on the third chapter of my second Zen Living manuscript...complete with photo edits. Just flowed this afternoon. Like butter. Wish it was always that smooth! Anyway...Go ME
Celebrating with a bottled Coke!

[FNAWrite]

This is an old thread so I'll skip the question posted and comment on the scene: Does anyone else think it is unlikely that a thieving scum pirate would simply warn someone caught in the act of stealing a "large gem" (an emerald no less) from said pirate?

"Aargh, next time you're in trouble."

What a friendly world that has been created.

[suzy1124]

This is an old thread so I'll skip the question posted and comment on the scene: Does anyone else think it is unlikely that a thieving scum pirate would simply warn someone caught in the act of stealing a "large gem" (an emerald no less) from said pirate?

"Aargh, next time you're in trouble."

What a friendly world that has been created.

FNA, Just out of sheer curiosity, when was the last time that you've ever posted something of a positive nature ?

[Maud Fitch]

This is an old thread so I'll skip the question posted and comment on the scene: Does anyone else think it is unlikely that a thieving scum pirate would simply warn someone caught in the act of stealing a "large gem" (an emerald no less) from said pirate?
"Aargh, next time you're in trouble."
What a friendly world that has been created.

FNA, Just out of sheer curiosity, when was the last time that you've ever posted something of a positive nature ?

Suzy, just out of sheer curiosity, when was the last time that you've ever posted something related to book reading?

[FNAWrite]

I'm positive no pirate would let a person attempting to steal something from the pirate off with a warning.

Suzy, you find that to be unfair criticism of the scene? Certainly you can address this topic substantively.

There's enough foamy feel-good brain soap on every discussion board that I see no need to add to it. I do not recall that the OP requested that only praise be given.

[tbughi1]

I'm positive no pirate would let a person attempting to steal something from the pirate off with a warning.

Suzy, you find that to be unfair criticism of the scene? Certainly you can address this topic substantively.

There's enough foamy feel-good brain soap on every discussion board that I see no need to add to it. I do not recall that the OP requested that only praise be given.

Well, if you insist.

The scene you read was out a rough draft for a third book in a series, so you're kind of missing a lot of background on the world's lore and setting. I'll give you two (there's a few minor others but these two are most important, I believe) good reasons why murder wasn't just committed.

1) This scene takes places in a city created by angels. You can likely imagine such a place would have very strict laws that weren't exactly lenient on such violent vigilantly justice as you've implied. Likely a pirate who wanted to stay out of a jail cell so he could take to the sea again would be very aware of this.

2) This particular character may be some nameless pirate to you, but I make no characters without a full personality. Whether or not the full personality is seen by the reader is a different story, but this particular pirate's name is Lonzo Romero. He's an older gent, travels alone mostly, but is generally a well liked guy. This being some of things you find out about him in the subsequent chapters and next book. Perhaps had Abe tried to rob a different pirate, things would have turned out differently, but Lonzo's patience is renowned.

FNA, you assume too much about the world from too short a description. It might be you were just playing devil's advocate, in which case I appreciate taking a look at things from an alternative position. One cannot fix flaws they are unaware of or refuse to acknowledge, and I can certainly see how this scene can in no part describe what came before and what comes after. However, in this scene, to have the pirate react any differently would have been blatant violence for the sake of violence, which would have shattered the immersion of the story.

[FNAWrite]

You know,” Abe whispered, “for a bunch of thieving scum, they sure don’t seem too worried about getting robbed.”

And for a town where a reader should " likely imagine such a place would have very strict laws that weren't exactly lenient", appartently even characters in the book missed this. Because no, I cannot imagine a town where violence is strictly punished but thievery is acceptable. You in fact describe the pirates as thieving scum.

Let me address "FNA, you assume too much about the world from too short a description" - the only assumption I made is that a pirate is a pirate, not someone who was worries about the legal consequences of their actions (especially not in such circumstances, i9.e. a thief caught in the act, pirate drunk). You describe these pirates as ragged and armed to the teeth and laden with gems and coins. Do they carry daggers, rapiers and cutlasses as fashion statements or are these men of violence as all other pirates? They do seem to be described as other pirates, right up to drunk and unconscious in the very doorway of the tavern in this law-abiding city created by angels. You use the word "likely" twice in your description. You wrote it; couldn't you say whether some condition is actual rather than "it's likely".
\
Lonzo's patience is renowned. The patient pirate who says I'll cut your hand off.

I further disagree with your explanation that "in this scene, to have the pirate react any differently would have been blatant violence for the sake of violence". For a pirate to react violently to a theft from his very person would be violence for the sake of violence? How about violence for self-protection? Abe's hand is at his throat. Violence to protect one's valuable property? I can't see that having a heavily armed pirate (I do assume that even in a city crerated by angels pirates are not priests) defend his riches against an assault on his person is violence for the sake of violence. You have set this scene in a bar full of heavily armed drunken pirates. To have violence occur would be unexpected, gratuitous?

Is it your position that your character is a 'nice guy' pirate who has lived a long life among other presumably less patient pirates without engaging in violent behavior? That too does not ring of the truth of pirates.

It's your story. You can indeed love your own story and think that the passage you cited is just what you wqant.

i am not obliged to do so. If I find the behavior of pirates in a den of thieves to be unrealistic, that is how it struck me.

Would any reaeder know that the pirate character at issue here was Lonzo the patient pirate? Since the pirate is not identified, I wonder whether anyone else reading this might think this pirate was an ordinary, run-of-the-mill pirate without a lot of patience with those who would steal from him. That's certainly what I thought.

[tbughi1]

Lol, kinda glad I responded. This is fun

You know,” Abe whispered, “for a bunch of thieving scum, they sure don’t seem too worried about getting robbed.”

And for a town where a reader should " likely imagine such a place would have very strict laws that weren't exactly lenient", appartently even characters in the book missed this. Because no, I cannot imagine a town where violence is strictly punished but thievery is acceptable. You in fact describe the pirates as thieving scum.

Me? Good sir/ma'm, that was Abe who called the pirates thieving scum. Abe is a character with thoughts and biases like any normal human being. Obviously Abe was being more insulting than he was fair. After all, after saying this, he tried to touch a pirate's jewels. You're going to get in much hot water if you trust every word a character says.

Let me address "FNA, you assume too much about the world from too short a description" - the only assumption I made is that a pirate is a pirate, not someone who was worries about the legal consequences of their actions (especially not in such circumstances, i9.e. a thief caught in the act, pirate drunk). You describe these pirates as ragged and armed to the teeth and laden with gems and coins. Do they carry daggers, rapiers and cutlasses as fashion statements or are these men of violence as all other pirates? They do seem to be described as other pirates, right up to drunk and unconscious in the very doorway of the tavern in this law-abiding city created by angels. You use the word "likely" twice in your description. You wrote it; couldn't you say whether some condition is actual rather than "it's likely".
\
Lonzo's patience is renowned. The patient pirate who says I'll cut your hand off.

The only assumption you made is that a pirate is a pirate? Well now, how terrible of a writer would I be if I just force-fed you the stereotypical, monologue, predictable, flat, unevolving characters you already know? Next you'll be telling me I didn't describe Abe as a gunslinger correctly because he didn't have a cigarette or talk with a sothron' accent.

I further disagree with your explanation that "in this scene, to have the pirate react any differently would have been blatant violence for the sake of violence". For a pirate to react violently to a theft from his very person would be violence for the sake of violence? How about violence for self-protection? Abe's hand is at his throat. Violence to protect one's valuable property? I can't see that having a heavily armed pirate (I do assume that even in a city crerated by angels pirates are not priests) defend his riches against an assault on his person is violence for the sake of violence. You have set this scene in a bar full of heavily armed drunken pirates. To have violence occur would be unexpected, gratuitous?

Is it your position that your character is a 'nice guy' pirate who has lived a long life among other presumably less patient pirates without engaging in violent behavior? That too does not ring of the truth of pirates.

I can only picture you smiling as you write this, but eh, I've been wrong before. I honestly just can't picture what you're implying here. Lonzo had just met these pirates the previous night. Abe is a young gentlemen more curious than anything else. Lonzo warned him because Lonzo does not feel, even in the slightest, threatened by Abe. The calmness with which he rebuked Abe and then went back to sleep is homage to his unperturbed and untroubled feelings. Ah! I just realized you don't know Abe or what he looks like. Oh god, I can't explain here a character developed over 3 books. I'll try though. He's young, would have appeared terrified when Lonzo woke up. Lonzo would have seen this and just tossed him aside, as he clearly did.

It's your story. You can indeed love your own story and think that the passage you cited is just what you wqant.

i am not obliged to do so. If I find the behavior of pirates in a den of thieves to be unrealistic, that is how it struck me.

Would any reaeder know that the pirate character at issue here was Lonzo the patient pirate? Since the pirate is not identified, I wonder whether anyone else reading this might think this pirate was an ordinary, run-of-the-mill pirate without a lot of patience with those who would steal from him. That's certainly what I thought.

I can do nothing for your bias. You are determined that pirates fit your narrow definition of them. To this, I can only shrug, but I will not apologize for having dimensional characters and an unpredictable plot.

I do wonder what your next response will be. I know you have sooo many more complaints! =D