Tips for a newbie writer

[rachel_bruhn]

I am looking for some tips on how to turn ideas into stories that people would want to read. I have been dabbling with writing a story, but I have yet to be satisfied with the initial result. One particular piece I thought read well, however I don't know where to take it. I have a few ideas, but I can't settle on anything. Another project is an idea for a book/series, but when I start writing it doesn't come out as well as it sounds in my head. I understand that each piece will likely require multiple revisions and editions, but at this point I feel stuck before even getting that far.

What are your suggestions for developing a good writing piece? Should I make outlines or brainstorm? Is there a starting organizational approach that might help? I was always better at free writing than using outlines, but I'm not opposed to the extra work if it will help my writing.

[moderntimes]

First suggestion is to be very familiar with your genre. If you for example like fantasy, read, read, read many excellent top-ranked fantasies, especially of the "flavor" you prefer -- juvenile, adult, more violent, more mystery, whatever. We learn first by knowing our directions and therefore it's best to read a lot of the thing you want most to write.

Next, just write, write, write. Don't become dissuaded if your first stuff is awkward. You will become better but it takes time and many false trials before you get better. There is no fast track -- all you need is what all writers do: Just start writing. Don't trash anything. Save even your worst stuff so you can learn from it, and also, occasionally you might find a hidden gem in an otherwise bad story you'd written a year ago. Good.

I'd recommend the excellent book by Stephen King "On Writing" -- it's about the best thing I've ever read on that subject.

And good luck!

[rachel_bruhn]

I think that's part of my problem.....not really having a "genre" that I prefer. I'll read just about anything if it is captivating enough! Maybe I should just take the story that I started and write it in multiple directions and decide which one I like best, or which one develops naturally. Thanks for the tips!

[moderntimes]

Well, take some ventures in your writing to several pathways, a good idea. But also, don't try to be everything to everyone. Find your "voice" -- and the only way you can do this is to keep writing. And of course reading.

But there have to be certain venues and rhythms which you prefer. For example, I'm writing a series of modern American private detective novels which are within the general and overall category of "mystery" but I personally eschew the "cozy" sort of mystery -- the overly sedate "Miss Marple" sort of mystery per Agatha Christie. This isn't dissing that genre but I myself don't care for it and therefore my reading, and my writing tend toward the more realistic and more "adult" type of thriller.

Likewise there have to be certain aspects of a particular genre which you're more comfy with. If you for example like romances, but not the overly puffy and sugary type of "teenage" book but like a more realistic type of adult-oriented modern romance, that may be your best path, or conversely if you DO prefer the sort-of 19th century style, stick with that.

Your writing "voice" is based on several things -- the particular genre you prefer, your general writing style (short and terse like Hemingway or longer and more lyrical like Faulkner) and the subject matter. Plus of course your specific word choice and audience. All these things contributed to the individual author's "voice" and only by writing a lot can you best find it.

Good luck, too!

[rachel_bruhn]

You are very insightful! Most of my writing experience has been essays and similar writing pieces for education, which is completely different than novel writing. I like the idea of finding my own "voice", whatever that may be. Sounds like I need to just start writing.

[WilliamsQ]

@moderntimes, you covered this topic beautifully. There's really nothing more for me to add.

Read your genre, and write write write. Also make sure to get people to read your work, because they will notice things you won't because a writer can get "too close" to their work, and not see it from an outside perspective.

[moderntimes]

Yes, it's good for others to see what you're writing. But for a newbie, I recommend caution. Here's why...

You may find a friend who just wants to be kindhearted and only say nice things, even if there are places where your writing could be improved. And conversely, another pal may not like the genre you choose and diss your writing just because it's not their cuppa tea.

This isn't fantasy because I've come across both in my own experience. One friend had a look at my novel in progress and said glowing things, but when I asked her "Did you catch the trick about the logo for the warehouse?" or "What about the shootout at the restaurant?" and she was unable to comment, I realized that she'd not read it at all, was just trying to be nice to me.

And another friend took my book apart, dissected each flaw and kept reminding me (in a lengthy 12 page commentary!) that in real life this cop wouldn't do such, and in real life the private eye wouldn't do that. And I had to remind him that yeah, but I wasn't writing a documentary and that in real life, a private detective would NEVER be allowed access to crime scenes as my fictional guy was, and so on. Yes I try to keep my stories pretty realistic but not 100% and yeah I stretch reality a little. In real life the private eye would be sitting at his computer all day.

In other words, accept all criticism but take it with a grain of salt and trust your instincts. Now, if you find pals who are very well acquainted with the genre in which you're writing, then yes, that is very beneficial. Just realize that your friends may not be the best of critics, even if they're well meaning.

Which is why it's essential that you read a LOT of the genre you choose to write in, so that you will be a better judge of your own writing.

Now again, you don't want to be a copycat and write a "me too" story that's an exact image of your fave story. If you try that, your words will not ring true. Learn your genre and then work within that genre, but bend the parameters a little so that your story will be more unique but still be "okay" for genre readership.

For example -- and yeah I give my own stuff as examples but that's first person experience, not something i "heard about" on the internet -- it's real. The stereotype private eye is the rough, tough guy in trench coat with pint of rye in his hip pocket, and so on. I wanted to tweak the image, so I created my own PI who's highly educated and intelligent, has a decent house, and is mostly nonviolent. But the further tweak is that he gets drawn into nasty situations and the arc of the character is how he, a relatively stable and educated guy, becomes tainted by the violence.

So I stay within the genre of private detective but my PI is different from most. And it worked, apparently, because I've got a publishing contract to prove it.

All I'm saying is that you need to balance your writing and work within the genre but push the edge of the envelope at the same time. And the only way you will learn this is by lots and lots of reading, and then to keep writing and writing until your skill improves. And never give up!

-- 19 Sep 2015, 07:03 --

Newbie, I have some further thoughts based on my own personal experience of the last couple days, so this is fresh off the press...

I'm starting my 4th mystery novel, a series of modern American private detective stories. I had a few possible routes to take in the story, and I did NOT know in advance where to go. But I just started writing anyway.

This is something I want to impress on many new writers. I'm sure that there are a few writing geniuses out there, whose stories spring full blown in their minds like Athena springing full grown from the brow (meaning the mind) of Zeus. These rare and very special writers are like literary Mozarts, where the words are just in the mind and all the writer has to do is put them onto the page (or screen), and they're done!

Well, I can tell you in very clear and certain terms that for most writers, from prolific greats like Stephen King down to low echelon authors like myself, that writing starts with an innate talent, true. But the real aspects of writing come from hard work. Writers take their initial talent and hone it with lots of conscious effort, starting with reading plenty of the sort of writing they most appreciate and want to emulate, and then further developing that skill by doing one thing: Writing.

It's the very process of writing that makes this work. If you (or any other aspiring writer) thinks "Oh, I'll sit around and think a lot and bingo! the story will be there" that's not gonna work. You learn to write by writing. Let me repeat:

You learn to write by writing.

I started my novel by first giving thought to a theme, a very vague concept, yes. But I quickly cast aside the pondering and simply started "Chapter 1" and started putting words on the screen (I have learned over the years to write straight into the laptop. It goes from brain to MS-Word without any intervening notebook or scribbling into a journal).

Now I wanted to tell the story of how my private detective gets involved in what is first thought to be the accidental death of an friend, who's run down while on his bicycle in a hit-and-run. Tragic, yes, probably some drunk. But then evidence surfaces that the death might have been premeditated murder.

Now this paragraph above is ALL I HAD before I started writing. Nothing else. I started chapter 1 this way:

Death never comes as a guest. It’s always an intruder into our lives, even for the aged and infirm. But when that dark and final veil arrives unexpectedly, with no time for the least preparation, the impact is even worse. And this time, death once more had descended upon a close friend and was delivered to us with violence.


And I then described the atmosphere of the man's house where the wake was being held after the church funeral. And as I wrote, I "invented" some secondary characters in the story, one of whom will be the instigator in the man's death. Let me be clear on this. I don't at this time even know WHY the murder was committed exactly. I'm not even sure WHO did it.

But as I continue to write, the plot begins to form in my mind, and yesterday I had about 5000 good words and I was off and running on the new novel. Now all I've got to do is write those teeny and insignificant 75,000 other words, ha ha.

Point I'm trying to make is that I've found that actually writing, even just the description of the man's home and the friends and neighbors visiting, the post-funeral atmosphere, and all this, spurred new and fresh ideas in my mind.

As I said, at this point I don't know exactly where the story will lead me, but now I'm forming small ideas and clues and I know that these will soon develop into a good story. Some of the tentative ideas or plot routes which I write down will end up being deleted and rewritten as the story proceeds. I know this. But I also know that if I'd sat around and mulled over what I was going to write, it would have never been done. It's the very act of writing that forms the further and better aspects of the new novel in progress.

I've said this before in other postings: Never say to yourself "I'd like to be a writer..." or "I someday want to write a novel..." because if you say this to yourself, you will NEVER go any further. Instead tell yourself "I AM a writer!" and "I AM writing a novel!"

And then, of course start writing. Take that blank page or screen and just START! Believe me, it will work.

Also, I recommend that you check out other threads in the "Writing" section which I've recently started. I've got further ideas and there are some great added commentaries by others in the forum as well.

And feel free to PM me if you want specific help.

[rachel_bruhn]

Thanks so much! I love how honest you are about everything. Some people might try to mask all the hard work and effort, but we both know reality is that there is a lot of hard work needed. One day in the future I WILL have something ready for review by others and I can't wait to share my voice with prospective readers.

[moderntimes]

Glad to be of help anytime. Jump into the writer's pond and keep swimming, okay?

[LadyE]

Well, I may be repeating myself from other posts, but the most successful way I have used to have some semblance of order is to take your idea and make a bubble chart. Go nuts with your details. You will use the details or not. It's up to you, and you will be able to write from that chart. Do this with all of your story ideas separately. You could end up with several books this way! It's a process so allow the process and the story time to develop.

[moderntimes]

And per your previous posts, Lady, if a bubble chart works for you, by all means go for it.

I myself have found that various tricks for writing -- bubble chart or snowflake method or whatever -- just don't work for me. I instead just start with "Chapter 1" and plunge ahead.

Regarding details, it's a good idea to have details ready to insert into a story, true. But some new writers can get so bogged down with minute details that they become swamped and lose the thread of action totally. I'd therefore recommend a balanced approach, keeping plot details and descriptions low key until you build the story line better and then to use details to flesh out the principal story.

Nevertheless, whatever works for each writer is the best for that writer. Hamlet said "the readiness is all" and I'd alter that, "the writing is all".

-- 21 Sep 2015, 05:07 --

Thinking about your mention of a bubble chart, I came to the possible realization that you're really talking about a Venn diagram instead.

No biggie, as whatever works for you is fine, but I think that according to your description, it's maybe a Venn diagram?

[rachel_bruhn]

I doubt she is talking about a venn diagram, since that is to compare and contrast things. I get what she is saying about a "bubble chart". For example, I could make a bubble for my main character and stemming from that bubble could be bubbles with attributes I wanted him/her to have, such as personality traits, profession, passions, etc. Not sure if it is something I would want to invest time on, simply because I could add forever! I'm better with lists and possibly outlines. I am open to trying different approaches and finding the way that works best for me. I appreciate the ideas and input, as it gives me different approaches (that have worked for others) that may work for me too!

[moderntimes]

Thanks for the info, Rachel. I'm okay with either. And the bubble chart you folks use is not the "official" bubble graph mode as I've seen in books and such, usually meant for grouping several sets of linked data but not centered on the same locus. That's how statisticians use a bubble chart.

But that's picking nits. I understand the purpose of this mode of "gathering wool" and have tried similar methods in the past. I guess that much of my old "day job" habits have bled over into the way I prep for writing. In some work I've done it was not allowed to keep separate notes due to legal or security issues and therefore everything had to be kept in a standardized format for archival retrieval. And having done programming so long, I simply got used to entering everything straight into the computer. Therefore I rarely scribble any notes on paper these days.

Regardless, my "ideas" folder and in that folder my keeping various separate files containing brainstorming and such info is equivalent to the bubble method or any other way that works for the writer. Whatever makes it run smoother is the way to go, you choose the best route.

However what I've seen occasionally is that a fledgling writer will get hung up on the planning, be stuck into the "snowflake" method of planning to write so much that the actual writing never gets off first base. It's essential, I think, for the writer to keep the final objective in mind always -- that the actual planning or outlining methods are only a crutch to enable the author to eventually create that good short story or novel.

Thanks again.

[rachel_bruhn]

I agree. As I mentioned before, I could easily see myself going a little overboard on trying to plan out (in one form or another) all of the details for the characters, settings, etc. and not devote enough time to the actual plot. I think we are similar in that we just work best putting pen to paper (so to speak) and going at it. On essays I rarely read back over it, but for a book I think it is necessary!

[moderntimes]

What I think happens is that if you use planning** to develop a novel, that's fine, especially at the beginning. I've found however that after I get started, I'm good with just writing and not much reference to the planning guide afterward.

Now I DO have a "helper" file in for my novels. in that I put 1-line bios of each new character and the relationship for others in the book, and a quick note "good guy" or "bad guy" or "cousin to Vanessa" or whatever. That way, until I'm familiar with the spelling of the new characters' names I won't mess up. In my 4th book now in progress, one of my principal plots deals with a Vietnamese ancestry group. I researched Viet names and chose those which are fairly easily spelled and recognized by most readers, those names without hyphens or apostrophes. Such more easily spelled names are just as authentic however, and since I'm playing god here, I get to pick and choose who my people will be, and whether they'll get killed off, ha ha.

In this helper file I also put a few brief paragraphs about major plot points: "Ophelia goes nuts and drowns herself" or "Hamlet stabs Polonius accidentally" and so on, so as to help keep me on track.

But I nowadays don't feel the need to do any sort of extensive outlining or diagramming or whatever. For a newbie writer, if it helps, sure. What I've found however is that once you get going, you'll need far less extensive planning and be able to launch right into the writing itself much more confidently. As I say, "We learn to write by writing" and this also tends to reduce the need for lots of outlining or bubble charts or whatever. As you develop as a writer you'll find that these things are more and more able to be kept in the writing brain rather than on paper or standby documents.

My only caution about planning is that if it's overdone, it can result in "I'll plan more now and start writing for real tomorrow" which is, as Pirsig said in "Zen and the art of Motorcycle Maintenance" so perfectly defined as a "gumption trap" -- in other words, you end up putting all your efforts into planning and not the doing. I prefer Hamlet's admonition: "The readiness is all" and just jump into the deep end (with a life preserver of course).

** Re: Planning. Don't ya just HATE the term "pre-planning"? Talk about redundant. Arrgh.