Quick grammar question about these commas

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Marsha JJ
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Quick grammar question about these commas

Post by Marsha JJ »

Would you be so kind as to help me understand why the commas in each of these two sentences would be determined to be unnecessary? The grammar sources I checked indicate that they are required, so I am double checking with other grammar experts. Thanks for any advice.

(The first comma after "appreciated"):
1) The theme of close personal connection is one that I appreciated, since it’s increasingly rare to find it in today’s environment of digital overload and often superficial connections. - Unnecessary comma.

(The comma after "fishing"):
2) I found it interesting to learn how the women in the book approached the sport of fly fishing, since it is typically a male-dominated sport. - Unnecessary comma.
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MsH2k
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Post by MsH2k »

Hi.

This is one of those ambiguous comma scenarios. Can you give an example (and link) of a grammar source that indicated the comma is required in these cases?
"Knowing what must be done does away with fear."
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Post by The Holy Grail »

Hello @Marsha JJ, subordinate conjunctions don't require a comma before them if the subordinate clause they introduce comes after the main clause. It is only required after the subordinate clause [ul]if it precedes the main clause,[/ul] or before and after when it comes in the middle of the sentence (interrupts the sentence to be precise). I think for both of the sentences, the editor meant this scenario. Here's an example:

Since I came, I've not eaten. (Comma required after the subordinate clause.)
I've not eaten since I came. (comma not required.)
He slept in the street, since he didn't have anywhere to sleep, and caught pneumonia. (Required before and after; it interrupts the sentence.)

However, the above case can be subjective because the phrase followed by "since" may as well be parenthetical.
She went to the restaurant to eat (since she was hungry).
The above can also be written as: "She went to the restaurant to eat, since she was hungry." Here, the comma has been used to mark the start of the parenthesis, and this overrides the previous statement that subordinate clauses don't require a comma before them, because the subordinate clause here is non-restrictive/parenthetical. (This is the same logic with the previous third instance since a subordinate clause in the middle of a sentence mostly qualifies as an added information.)

I've not consulted any sources though, so I can't prove this; I'm just saying what I'd been taught in high school.
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Post by MsH2k »

Marsha JJ wrote: 30 Apr 2022, 15:19 Would you be so kind as to help me understand why the commas in each of these two sentences would be determined to be unnecessary? The grammar sources I checked indicate that they are required, so I am double checking with other grammar experts. Thanks for any advice.

(The first comma after "appreciated"):
1) The theme of close personal connection is one that I appreciated, since it’s increasingly rare to find it in today’s environment of digital overload and often superficial connections. - Unnecessary comma.

(The comma after "fishing"):
2) I found it interesting to learn how the women in the book approached the sport of fly fishing, since it is typically a male-dominated sport. - Unnecessary comma.
As @The Holy Grail mentioned, there are instances when a comma may be acceptable in these cases. Here is a link that describes some of those times. https://style.mla.org/commas-with-because/

The question remains what grammar sources indicated the commas were required. If it was flagged by a grammar checker, that is not conclusive enough. Many times, grammar checkers are not reliable for comma usage because they do not detect the nuances of the writer. If you can support your usage with a reputable link, you can feel more confident about your comma placement and can even request a recheck with proper documentation.
"Knowing what must be done does away with fear."
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Post by Emidio Inocencio »

Since while used as a subordinate conjunction doesn't require commas before or after it. Therefore, your first sentence is hard to grasp. It appears to be a run on sentence. But, in the second sentence, there shouldn't be a coma as since is working as a subordinate conjunction.
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Post by Marsha JJ »

Thanks everyone for the great feedback. One of you asked who indicated that the commas were required, and I believe that it was Grammarly. I think we have now beat this horse to death, so we can probably let this question rest. I appreciate everyone who took the time to share insights. Thank you.
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