I Beg to Differ.

Use this forum to discuss the May 2020 Book of the month, "Grace Revealed: Finding God's Strength in Any Crisis" by Frederick J. Sievert.
Post Reply
User avatar
Nerea
Bookshelves Moderator
Posts: 2268
Joined: 11 May 2018, 05:13
2019 Reading Goal: 15
2019 Reading Goal Completion: 166
2018 Reading Goal: 10
2018 Reading Goal Completion: 80
Favorite Author: William H. Coles
Currently Reading:
Bookshelf Size: 472
Reviewer Page: onlinebookclub.org/reviews/by-nerea.html
Latest Review: Little White Lies by JC Anderson
fav_author_id: 89641

I Beg to Differ.

Post by Nerea »

I like how the author defines Grace (undeserved kindness) and reveals how it affects us. But I beg to differ a little bit with the author’s sentiments in location 343, paragraph 2 where the author talks about how God views us as individuals. He says;

“To be in Christ means that when God looks at you, He doesn’t see all your sins, failures, and rough spots. When you are in Christ, God just sees Jesus. You may see the scars, the mess, and the problems, but God sees perfection in Jesus.”

I don’t know if I’m the one who got it wrong. Feel free to correct me. My issue comes in where the author says, God does not see our effects of imperfection, but He sees perfection in Jesus. I believe God is aware of all our sinful inclinations, and He wants us to change and become useful vessels in His service. To achieve that, He has used His word and His Holy Spirit to help us correct our weaknesses so that we can attain perfection/holiness. He provides comfort whenever we feel low, through the Bible, and give us the strength that will help us endure all our “rough spots.” For God to draw us closer to Christ, He chooses to look at the good in us despite our bad tendencies, failures, and trials. (Ref; Genesis 6:5, Psalms 51:5, Isaiah 48:17,18, 1 peter 1:14-16, 2 Corinthians 1:3,4, John 6:44, Psalms 103:12-14).

Does God only “see perfection in Jesus,” or is He also interested in us as individuals?
"Regular reading improves your grammar."

User avatar
Dragonsend
Posts: 637
Joined: 05 Mar 2019, 19:30
2019 Reading Goal: 12
2019 Reading Goal Completion: 525
Currently Reading:
Bookshelf Size: 105
Reviewer Page: onlinebookclub.org/reviews/by-dragonsend.html
Latest Review: House of Eire by June Gillam

Post by Dragonsend »

Most definitely he sees us as individuals. It seems that this comes up a lot in my situation, people think that if God has our path laid out for us from the time that we are born, that we are but his puppet so they waste a lot of time rebelling. God definitely has a plan and a purpose for each of us as individuals. We are each a very unique creation but he gives us free will and some people believe that if they choose God then they are giving up that individuality and their freedom. This, and I state this emphatically, just isn't so. God does want us to be perfect and he loves us as no other and every day is an opportunity to change and strive for what God has allotted for us in this life and in Heaven.
Death,illness, accidents etc are learning experiences and trials that we must face. With faith these experiences are like day to night when faced without God's grace and guidance. I know that sounds like the company line but I am here to testify that it is the truth! Without God we think that we are handling things just fine but that is far from reality.
As far as letting God lead, well I think I would get tired of the stench of my own sins in my nostrils and would have to let's someone else have the reigns.We are meant for perfection but in God's way and not our own. So in answer yes yes yes God most definitely sees us as individuals.
The Lord is not slow to fulfill his promise as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing that any should perish, but that all should reach repentance. 2 Peter 3:9 :angelic-grayflying:

User avatar
B Creech
Previous Member of the Month
Posts: 1736
Joined: 09 Mar 2019, 13:34
2019 Reading Goal: 50
2019 Reading Goal Completion: 126
Favorite Book: The Reel Sisters
Currently Reading:
Bookshelf Size: 234
Reviewer Page: onlinebookclub.org/reviews/by-b-creech.html
Latest Review: Something in the Middle by A.I. Wand

Post by B Creech »

Yes, God sees us as individuals. However, when He looks at us, He sees Jesus, and that is because Jesus died for our sins, past, present, and those we haven't even committed yet! The blood of Jesus covers us, so when God looks at us, He sees Jesus because we are in Christ and He is in us once we are saved. Jesus is sitting on the right hand of God interceding for us when we pray, so I believe that is what the author might have meant about God seeing Jesus when He looks at us. Another of the great mysteries of the Bible and God!
B. Creech

User avatar
Deborah kalu
Posts: 64
Joined: 28 Apr 2020, 06:41
2019 Reading Goal: 50
Currently Reading: A Giant Below
Bookshelf Size: 22

Post by Deborah kalu »

When God look at us he see JESUS, I think this is where the tittle of these book (grace revealed)came from.through the blood of Jesus Christ we are justified.

User avatar
Dragonsend
Posts: 637
Joined: 05 Mar 2019, 19:30
2019 Reading Goal: 12
2019 Reading Goal Completion: 525
Currently Reading:
Bookshelf Size: 105
Reviewer Page: onlinebookclub.org/reviews/by-dragonsend.html
Latest Review: House of Eire by June Gillam

Post by Dragonsend »

B Creech wrote:
01 May 2020, 16:06
Yes, God sees us as individuals. However, when He looks at us, He sees Jesus, and that is because Jesus died for our sins, past, present, and those we haven't even committed yet! The blood of Jesus covers us, so when God looks at us, He sees Jesus because we are in Christ and He is in us once we are saved. Jesus is sitting on the right hand of God interceding for us when we pray, so I believe that is what the author might have meant about God seeing Jesus when He looks at us. Another of the great mysteries of the Bible and God!
I think God sees Jesus in all of us, if we could all accept the gift of Grace without abusing that love that undying, and all encompassing love , then this world would be completely different. I know he sees our individuality but also Jesus for all he has done. God gave the world Jesus and though it was written that he would die, the world returned that love with a multitude of sins. The way I see it is like this, why would I want to cause anyone pain by my actions, if I refrain from sin and live my life as Jesus asked then I would not add one more twinge to Jesus or God.
The Lord is not slow to fulfill his promise as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing that any should perish, but that all should reach repentance. 2 Peter 3:9 :angelic-grayflying:

User avatar
Dragonsend
Posts: 637
Joined: 05 Mar 2019, 19:30
2019 Reading Goal: 12
2019 Reading Goal Completion: 525
Currently Reading:
Bookshelf Size: 105
Reviewer Page: onlinebookclub.org/reviews/by-dragonsend.html
Latest Review: House of Eire by June Gillam

Post by Dragonsend »

Deborah kalu wrote:
03 May 2020, 17:17
When God look at us he see JESUS, I think this is where the tittle of these book (grace revealed)came from.through the blood of Jesus Christ we are justified.
Yes, I believe that he sees Jesus as well, he sees our sins as red as Scarlett against the purity of Jesus, but he also sees us as individuals his creations loved immesurably.
The Lord is not slow to fulfill his promise as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing that any should perish, but that all should reach repentance. 2 Peter 3:9 :angelic-grayflying:

User avatar
djr6090
Posts: 617
Joined: 29 Jun 2019, 10:15
2019 Reading Goal: 40
2019 Reading Goal Completion: 125
Favorite Book: From Liberty to Magnolia: In Search of the American Dream
Currently Reading:
Bookshelf Size: 97
Reviewer Page: onlinebookclub.org/reviews/by-djr6090.html
Latest Review: Westcoast Bounty by Ian Kent

Post by djr6090 »

I think it is presumptuous to claim knowledge of what God sees. We can only hope he accepts us with all our faults and shortcomings.

User avatar
remimarcelle
Posts: 6
Joined: 07 May 2020, 17:04
Currently Reading: don juan
Bookshelf Size: 13

Post by remimarcelle »

Dragonsend wrote:
01 May 2020, 15:14
Most definitely he sees us as individuals. It seems that this comes up a lot in my situation, people think that if God has our path laid out for us from the time that we are born, that we are but his puppet so they waste a lot of time rebelling. God definitely has a plan and a purpose for each of us as individuals. We are each a very unique creation but he gives us free will and some people believe that if they choose God then they are giving up that individuality and their freedom. This, and I state this emphatically, just isn't so. God does want us to be perfect and he loves us as no other and every day is an opportunity to change and strive for what God has allotted for us in this life and in Heaven.
Death,illness, accidents etc are learning experiences and trials that we must face. With faith these experiences are like day to night when faced without God's grace and guidance. I know that sounds like the company line but I am here to testify that it is the truth! Without God we think that we are handling things just fine but that is far from reality.
As far as letting God lead, well I think I would get tired of the stench of my own sins in my nostrils and would have to let's someone else have the reigns.We are meant for perfection but in God's way and not our own. So in answer yes yes yes God most definitely sees us as individuals.
Are you talking about the book here or is this about how you feel about religion in general?

monicamu
Posts: 190
Joined: 24 Feb 2020, 03:18
Currently Reading: Wings Over Ghost Creek
Bookshelf Size: 34
Reviewer Page: onlinebookclub.org/reviews/by-monicamu.html
Latest Review: The King of May by Matthew Tysz

Post by monicamu »

Is this really an appropriate forum for a discussion on religion? I think not.

User avatar
Nerea
Bookshelves Moderator
Posts: 2268
Joined: 11 May 2018, 05:13
2019 Reading Goal: 15
2019 Reading Goal Completion: 166
2018 Reading Goal: 10
2018 Reading Goal Completion: 80
Favorite Author: William H. Coles
Currently Reading:
Bookshelf Size: 472
Reviewer Page: onlinebookclub.org/reviews/by-nerea.html
Latest Review: Little White Lies by JC Anderson
fav_author_id: 89641

Post by Nerea »

Dragonsend wrote:
01 May 2020, 15:14
Most definitely he sees us as individuals. It seems that this comes up a lot in my situation, people think that if God has our path laid out for us from the time that we are born, that we are but his puppet so they waste a lot of time rebelling. God definitely has a plan and a purpose for each of us as individuals. We are each a very unique creation but he gives us free will and some people believe that if they choose God then they are giving up that individuality and their freedom. This, and I state this emphatically, just isn't so. God does want us to be perfect and he loves us as no other and every day is an opportunity to change and strive for what God has allotted for us in this life and in Heaven.
Death,illness, accidents etc are learning experiences and trials that we must face. With faith these experiences are like day to night when faced without God's grace and guidance. I know that sounds like the company line but I am here to testify that it is the truth! Without God we think that we are handling things just fine but that is far from reality.
As far as letting God lead, well I think I would get tired of the stench of my own sins in my nostrils and would have to let's someone else have the reigns.We are meant for perfection but in God's way and not our own. So in answer yes yes yes God most definitely sees us as individuals.
I agree. God has a purpose for us and that we are meant for perfection in God's way and not our own. Thank you for your input.
"Regular reading improves your grammar."

User avatar
Nerea
Bookshelves Moderator
Posts: 2268
Joined: 11 May 2018, 05:13
2019 Reading Goal: 15
2019 Reading Goal Completion: 166
2018 Reading Goal: 10
2018 Reading Goal Completion: 80
Favorite Author: William H. Coles
Currently Reading:
Bookshelf Size: 472
Reviewer Page: onlinebookclub.org/reviews/by-nerea.html
Latest Review: Little White Lies by JC Anderson
fav_author_id: 89641

Post by Nerea »

monicamu wrote:
07 May 2020, 23:59
Is this really an appropriate forum for a discussion on religion? I think not.
No it's not. It's a forum to discuss about the contents portrayed in the book.
"Regular reading improves your grammar."

User avatar
Nerea
Bookshelves Moderator
Posts: 2268
Joined: 11 May 2018, 05:13
2019 Reading Goal: 15
2019 Reading Goal Completion: 166
2018 Reading Goal: 10
2018 Reading Goal Completion: 80
Favorite Author: William H. Coles
Currently Reading:
Bookshelf Size: 472
Reviewer Page: onlinebookclub.org/reviews/by-nerea.html
Latest Review: Little White Lies by JC Anderson
fav_author_id: 89641

Post by Nerea »

djr6090 wrote:
05 May 2020, 09:55
I think it is presumptuous to claim knowledge of what God sees. We can only hope he accepts us with all our faults and shortcomings.
Why do you say so?
"Regular reading improves your grammar."

User avatar
Nerea
Bookshelves Moderator
Posts: 2268
Joined: 11 May 2018, 05:13
2019 Reading Goal: 15
2019 Reading Goal Completion: 166
2018 Reading Goal: 10
2018 Reading Goal Completion: 80
Favorite Author: William H. Coles
Currently Reading:
Bookshelf Size: 472
Reviewer Page: onlinebookclub.org/reviews/by-nerea.html
Latest Review: Little White Lies by JC Anderson
fav_author_id: 89641

Post by Nerea »

B Creech wrote:
01 May 2020, 16:06
Yes, God sees us as individuals. However, when He looks at us, He sees Jesus, and that is because Jesus died for our sins, past, present, and those we haven't even committed yet! The blood of Jesus covers us, so when God looks at us, He sees Jesus because we are in Christ and He is in us once we are saved. Jesus is sitting on the right hand of God interceding for us when we pray, so I believe that is what the author might have meant about God seeing Jesus when He looks at us. Another of the great mysteries of the Bible and God!
Oooooh, I get your point. Thanks.
"Regular reading improves your grammar."

User avatar
Deborah kalu
Posts: 64
Joined: 28 Apr 2020, 06:41
2019 Reading Goal: 50
Currently Reading: A Giant Below
Bookshelf Size: 22

Post by Deborah kalu »

djr6090 wrote:
05 May 2020, 09:55
I think it is presumptuous to claim knowledge of what God sees. We can only hope he accepts us with all our faults and shortcomings.
We don't hope we believe. This is where the word FAITH come in,if we don't believe in God and his righteousness then,that means, we don't also believe that he died on the cross to set us free from our sins

User avatar
Dragonsend
Posts: 637
Joined: 05 Mar 2019, 19:30
2019 Reading Goal: 12
2019 Reading Goal Completion: 525
Currently Reading:
Bookshelf Size: 105
Reviewer Page: onlinebookclub.org/reviews/by-dragonsend.html
Latest Review: House of Eire by June Gillam

Post by Dragonsend »

remimarcelle wrote:
07 May 2020, 19:23
Dragonsend wrote:
01 May 2020, 15:14
Most definitely he sees us as individuals. It seems that this comes up a lot in my situation, people think that if God has our path laid out for us from the time that we are born, that we are but his puppet so they waste a lot of time rebelling. God definitely has a plan and a purpose for each of us as individuals. We are each a very unique creation but he gives us free will and some people believe that if they choose God then they are giving up that individuality and their freedom. This, and I state this emphatically, just isn't so. God does want us to be perfect and he loves us as no other and every day is an opportunity to change and strive for what God has allotted for us in this life and in Heaven.
Death,illness, accidents etc are learning experiences and trials that we must face. With faith these experiences are like day to night when faced without God's grace and guidance. I know that sounds like the company line but I am here to testify that it is the truth! Without God we think that we are handling things just fine but that is far from reality.
As far as letting God lead, well I think I would get tired of the stench of my own sins in my nostrils and would have to let's someone else have the reigns.We are meant for perfection but in God's way and not our own. So in answer yes yes yes God most definitely sees us as individuals.
Are you talking about the book here or is this about how you feel about religion in general?
I was actually answering the forum question that was asked. The author made a statement that when God looks at us he only sees Jesus. I also "'beg to differ" with that statement. : 🙂
The Lord is not slow to fulfill his promise as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing that any should perish, but that all should reach repentance. 2 Peter 3:9 :angelic-grayflying:

Post Reply

Return to “Discuss "Grace Revealed " by Frederick J. Sievert”